Some problems with Gira KNX devices

[sx3]

Hello,

My house is based on mostly Gira/Jung (INSTA) KNX devices and have been running for about 4 years now.
I often have problem with this installation when power is cut-off and coming back. It's quite annoying even though I know how to fix it. But if my wife is home alone, there will be problems for sure!

As of today I have updated the Firmware on 2167 and 2070 to latest. Now just wait and see if it gets any better.

I have plenty of more devices, but theese are the ones that make trouble with me.

Gira 2167 00 - I04 - IP-Router (Powered from Jung 2002 640mA)
- I need to physically disconnect/reconnect the power-connection on the device. Cycling power on the Jung 2002 or using reset function doesn't work.
I think this problem is related to the Jung 2002 power supply, this problem is kind of new, only happening since last year

Gira 2070 00 - I01 - Logic Module (Powered from Jung 2002 640mA)
- I need to physically disconnect/reconnect the power-connection on the device. Cycling power on the Jung 2002 or using reset function doesn't work.
I think this problem is related to the Jung 2002 power supply, this problem is kind of new, only happening since last year

Gira 2180 00 - I02 - Dali Gateway
- It looses all the programming, almost as it never was saved. Needs a full programming to get up and running again.
Think it's a faulty device that would need to be replaced.

Jung 2316.16 - Rev 03 - Actuator (I have two of them)
- Freezes, does not respond to KNX telegrams. Cycling 230V doesn't help. I need to physically disconnect/reconnect the BUS terminal on the device. I need to remove the BUS terminal, then cycle 230V to the actuator, then reconnect the BUS-terminal.
Don't know whats wrong here, I have 2 identical devices, one makes trouble, the other works fine. Perhaps something with the power supply here aswell?


Any one had similar issues?

As for replacing products, are theese the products to go? I want the Auxilary 30V on PSU, this one from Gira/INSTA seemed to be fairly
priced..


replacement.JPG

[multimedia]

Gira 2180 00 - I02 - Dali Gateway
- It looses all the programming, almost as it never was saved. Needs a full programming to get up and running again.
Think it's a faulty device that would need to be replaced.

That's a known problem on a certain series that is produced by Insta for Gira, Jung, Berker, Hager...
After a power down that unit may loose the programming, even the physical address is gone. After the failure it shows "bc" on it's display (should mean "broadcast mode", but actually it's german and means "bin caputt"
The unit should be replaced by your dealer.

[sx3]

Haha, alright.. So that one is ruled out then. I have contacted Gira technical support and they confirm what you wrote. I have contacted the dealer and awaiting their reply.
Now it's juste the rest of the products left.

[gbglace]

(Powered from Jung 2002 640mA)

Is this your KNX-bus power supply too?

If yes, I would take a separate power supply for IP-Router and logic modul (both together is OK). In case of a bus reset all other devices are producing a lot of bus traffic and power consumtion so it can be possible that the power supply has not enough power to supply these two devices and they get inconsistent status.

[sx3]

Yes, I'm powering both the KNX-Bus and 2167+2070 from the Jung 2002 unit.
The 2167 and the 2070 have a consumption of 2W each, that would give 80mA in the higher end calculation each. In total 160mA.

I have 36 devices connected to the Bus, @ 10mA each, it would be 360mA.
So in total I should have 520 calculated mA.

Would it bepossible for the 640mA supply to be bogged down by 520mA connected current?

[gbglace]

KNX-power supply is for KNX-bus only, not for extra power input on several devices. The second output (30V or 29V) is for an additional KNX line only.

10mA for each KNX device is a good proxy for running system, but not during restart process of all devices.

Install a separate 24V power supply and every thing will be fine.

[sx3]

You are partially correct, the second output (yellow white) can be used to power i.e. IP-Router, it's stated in the technical manual.
However, it also states that only 1 should be connected to each PSU, while I more or less have 2 with the 2070 module.
I will move them both to a separate 24VDC PSU and see if it helps me out.

[Klaus Gütter]

the second output (yellow white) can be used to power i.e. IP-Router

Only if this is explicitely allowed in the specification of the IP-Router! This is a matter of insulation between the power input and the network jack.

[sx3]

Yes, of course.

I have now moved the 2167 + 2070 to a stand alone 24VDC 1,25A PSU. They powered up properly upon turning the electricity back on.
I need to do a long term test since this problem have been more intermittent, not always happening.

However, the 2316.16 that freezes, still freezes. I was hoping that decreasing load of KNX PSU might have solved this issue aswell.
So now I need to turn the 230V for this actuator off, unplug the KNX terminal. Power on and reconnect KNX terminal on this actuator.

[sx3]

A small update.

I have replaced the Jung 2316.16 to a new one and that solved the freezing problem. New unit was HW version 4, the old one was 3.
But I noticed that 2167 didn't power up properly even though I have moved it to a 24VDC PSU, the 2070 powered up properly. I had to cycle the PSU power to make the 2167 start up..


As for the DALI-gateway, I have returned it to the dealer, and they would send it down to Germany for repair/replacement. The dealer received it 10 days ago, I guess the replaement should arrive this upcoming week.