Zennio KLIC-DA interface for Daikin Altherma heat pump

[baggins]

Hi,

Sorry that this is in English, but although I read German, writing is something else. Please feel free to answer in German, I'll manage...

I have a Daikin Altherma L/W heatpump and wanted to integrate this in my KNX system. Zennio has a KNX interface for this: KLIC-DA.
This interface connects in parallel to the command panel of the Daikin.

For the most part, the interface works. I can read and set the setpoint, read the current water temperature, etc.

However, reading the produced or consumed energy does not work. The problem apparently with this is that the machine needs some sort of trigger in order to update these values. Just polling is not enough. I have to use the command panel to read out these values on the machine and only then will I get an updated value through the Zennio.

Obviously, walking over to the machine to get a new reading is not what I had in mind.

I wonder if anyone has used the same interface and would be interested in their experience.

Thanks in advance.

[Beke]

Hello baggins,

I have exact the same setup as you have and experience the same issue with my Zennio KLIC-DA. I do not receive any energy status messages (consumption/production). I have not tried to trigger the update via the Daikin interface (will try this tonight) but I identified a restart of the KLIC-DA does also update the energy values. Regarding consumption values I know it is required to connect the S0 interface but the produced energy values should work, as they got calculated without the S0 impulse.
Nevertheless I could not make it working and I was asking myself if you found already a way to fix this issue. Any hints are highly welcome!

Regards,
Benjamin

[baggins]

Hello Benjamin,
I have not made any progress so far...

I opened a case with Zennio support. They were unaware of the problem as the only test they did were with the Daikin command panel... The only result so far is that they now included this shortcoming in the User Manual...

In the mean time I have found out that Daikin uses the modbus protocol. In theory it should thus be possible to install a sniffer on the communication line to see what commands are sent from the Daikin command panel when energy values are read. It should then be possible to have a Rpi to send this command at periodic intervals. I have no knowledge of modbus so I did not go that route at this moment.

[Beke]

Hello baggins,
I also opened a case and they asked my for a bus monitor dump as well as my KNX project. I send those files yesterday. I hope they can fix this problem with a new application version. Basicly the device is able to read the energy values as a see the values being received once after reboot (even without interaction at the Daikin command panel). I am still confident that they are able to solve the problem, and I think they have to otherwise the features they promote are just not available.

I will keep you updated...

Regards,
Benjamin

[Beke]

Hello baggins,
bad news from the Zennio Support. In my case, even if they asked for a bus monitor trace and the KNX project, finally they just refereed to the tiny note in the users manual. "Note: these indicators are not updated when its status changes. In order to have these energy values updated, a request must be done from wired control of Altherma LT system."
I am not satisfied and I still think this is a bug and they should be able the receive the data because as soon as I program the KLIC-DA and it reboots the values are received once, even without a reboot of the Altherma or a trigger via the wired control.
Finally they offered my to create a feature request out of my case and that's it...I don't expect to have this feature being integrated by them, therefor I will send back my KLIC-DA.

Regards,
Benjamin

[baggins]

Hello Benjamin,

They put that note in the User Manual after I reported the issue to them...
I kept mine (I have in fact two of them as I have two heat pumps) because I could not find a decent alternative...

Regards,

[koenichIV]

Hallo, ihr kennt euch ja anscheinend gut aus mit dem ZENNIO ZN1CL-KLIC-DA.

Ich hätte noch ein paar Fragen.

Ich habe eine DAIKIN Altherma 3 R F
(Modellname Innengerät: EHVX08S23EA6VG)

Vom Prinzip her hätte ich einfach gern die Möglichkeit die Sachen die man per App steuern kann (Warmwasser an/aus; Vorlauftemperatur +1/-1 Grad) über KNX (oder auch anders) zu steuern.

Geht das mit diesem KNX Modul? Gibt es mittlerweile vielleicht sogar bessere Alternativen?

[baggins]

In principle this can be done with the Zennio KLIC-DA.
That being said, I do not use any of these settings for now. With floor heating there is no use in tinkering with them. I leave it to the built-in weather dependent regulator to control the machine.
I might start playing with the sanitary hot water settings once the electricity company starts implementing their new capacity based billing system (where the electricity bill depends on the maximum power used during any 15 minute interval). At that time it might be useful to switch off the hot water production when cooking on an electric furnace or charging an electric vehicle...

Contrary to what I stated in a previous post, Daikin does not use the modbus protocol. I was misled by the fact that there exists a controller which connects to the Daikin bus and presents modbus data to other devices...

[charlez]

Zennio hat hier ein paar Features verpasst.
Auslesen zusätzlicher externer Temperatursensor
Energieverbrauch
etc
Sie tun nichts mit angeforderten Funktionen

[koenichIV]

Thank you for your feedback!

I’ve got an photovoltaic system, so it’s often the case, that the Daikin think it’s useful to produce warm water in the night, although i don’t need it at this time and at day i can use my own produced electricity.

So i switch manually off warm water at the evening and on in the morning.


The reason i want to increase or decrease the flow temperature (Vorlauftemperatur) is that i only at 2 days a week i need a higher temperature in the rooms and want to increase the flow temperature in the morning at these days.

Nevertheless I want to use the built-in weather dependent regulator.



So, is the controller which connects to the Daikin bus maybe better and is able to do the things i mentioned?

Maybe better in output of energy consumption?

[stefank85]

Hallo,

ich habe eine Altherma 3 M (Monoblock) und hatte extra bei Zennio nachgefragt ob das Klic-DA funktioniert. Die Antwort war positiv. Nun habe ich letztes Wochenende es geschafft das Gerät mal zu kabeln. Die grüne LED blinkt munter, was heißen soll, dass das Gerät die Kommunikation auf dem P1/P2-Bus mitlesen kann. Leider kriege ich aber nix davon auf den KNX-Bus. Alle Werte sind immer 0°C. Ich habe aber auch noch nicht versucht Richtung Daikin zu schreiben (z.B. Warmwasser einschalten).

Falls jemand einen Tipp hat was man noch ausprobieren könnte - immer gerne.

[lukluk]

Hallo, ich würde gerne auf dem Bus erkennen, wenn meine Altherma aus Störung steht. Kann das das Klic-DA Modul auslesen?
Ich meine auch mal irgendwo gelesen zu haben, dass mit vorhandenem Klic-DA die Außentemperaturgeregelte Heizurve des Daikin nicht mehr funktioniert. Stimmt das?
Ansonsten würde ich einfach mittels PT1000 Sensoren und MDT SCN-RT6AP.01 ein paar Temperaturen auf den Bus bringen, und somit auch mittels Logik eine Heizungsstörung erkennen können.

[baggins]

Yes, the Klic-DA can read error messages.
The weather dependent heating curve of the Altherma remains operational with the Klic-DA.